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Kotone
Apr 20, 2010 14:57:49 GMT -5
Post by Fay on Apr 20, 2010 14:57:49 GMT -5
Okay:
Her goal is to get high on life.
Right now she isn't high on life.
Drugs enhance your sensory perceptions.
Thus, she gets more out of life due to drugs, and she loves it.
I care not what meanings other people have assigned to the phrase. Drugs are a part of life anyway. Doing ANYTHING in life that makes you enjoy it can be considered as getting high on life. As opposed to just going though life passively and not having any fun at all.
High on life = Having fun via life's many different assets.
Thus, if she wants to have fun via life's many assets, then doing drugs despite the fact that it'll kill her shows a power of will.
Oh, and I only suggested what I did because I thought it would be fun if you went around and judged other RP characters. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Kotone
Apr 20, 2010 23:41:16 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 20, 2010 23:41:16 GMT -5
Oh Stalemate, I thought you said Statement... yes I know what a stalemate is thank you...
I think that sums up the problem. I think they can. And why not?
She doesn't desire drugs more than acting, she's just at a low point in her life when she dies.
Aren't you jumping to conclusions?
Well, if you're high on life, and drugs are part of life. Than you could be high on both drugs and life? Or being high on drugs would be included in being high on life?
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Kotone
Apr 21, 2010 3:13:54 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on Apr 21, 2010 3:13:54 GMT -5
I think that sums up the problem. I think they can. And why not? She doesn't desire drugs more than acting, she's just at a low point in her life when she dies. I've been explaining this for sometime, and now I'm at the point where I'd rather ask you, what about her supports that she has a strong willpower? Along with that, I'd also like to ask you, what is left of that willpower when she resorts to using her addiction as a way to cope with her hard life? Aren't you jumping to conclusions? Well the conclusions that I'm arriving at are based on what you've already revealed about your character. I mean if I call myself a hero, but I'm known for comitting crimes because I enjoy the spoils of what I rape and plunder, I couldn't really call myself a hero, because I'm going back on what a hero is. I'd be considered a hypocrite, thus forcing me either to relinquish my title as a hero and replace it with a new one, or I'd have to fall back on explaining why I consider myself a hero, even though I commit crime. This is how I see your strength and weakness' effect on your character. Understand? Well, if you're high on life, and drugs are part of life. Than you could be high on both drugs and life? Or being high on drugs would be included in being high on life? Welp, Fayyra did bring this up as a point, but I don't see the need to push that as the true meaning. This is simply his preferred interpretation of a figure of speech that's meaning has always meant that that person refrained from doing drugs.
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Kotone
Apr 21, 2010 7:28:27 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 21, 2010 7:28:27 GMT -5
Did you just call me a welp?
Actually you seem to draw your own conclusions regardless of what I say...
And where does it say she uses drugs to cope with her hard life? This is the kind of drawing your own conclusions I'm talking about. This isn't based on anything I've revealed. I said she's addicted to drugs and you're reading into it.
Not really a valid comparison. Doing drugs isn't going back on willpower...
This is getting pretty ridiculous, there's no way I can answer these kind of challenges and I'm not sure you're being entirely logical. Can we please move on, you think a strong willed character can't be addicted to drugs and I think she can. Sure you've explained why you think that way, and I still disagree.
I'm getting tired of playing ping pong.
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Kotone
Apr 21, 2010 12:24:33 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on Apr 21, 2010 12:24:33 GMT -5
Did you just call me a welp? Relax it's a Figure of speech. "Welp" is another way of saying "Well". I'm getting tired of playing ping pong. If you were to compare this to ping pong, you would actually have to be playing in the sense that when I hit the ball I'm stating my point, and you return it with your point that should counter mine. So to be honest, you aren't even playing. The ball has just been hitting you and you have been refusing to hit it back. Actually you seem to draw your own conclusions regardless of what I say... And where does it say she uses drugs to cope with her hard life? This is the kind of drawing your own conclusions I'm talking about. This isn't based on anything I've revealed. I said she's addicted to drugs and you're reading into it. In your own words... Getting divorced in your twenties sounds rough and you yourself said she was depressed. Then you stated she began using drugs in order to cope with the stress and depression. So she pretty much is using heroine as a crutch, because she herself isn't strong willed enough to deal with the shit life has handed her. I could see if she did heroine before she met and divorced her husband, but you never said that. He left and the drug replaced him. So, she's using it because her will isn't capable of pushing her past this so she can continue to succeed. Not really a valid comparison. Doing drugs isn't going back on willpower... I'll admit that wasn't the best comparison, because that hero could be considered a hero amongst his people, but I couldn't really come up with much at the time. However, In her case, using drugs is going back on her willpower, because she's using it because her will isn't strong enough to keep her focused and not depressed. This is getting pretty ridiculous, there's no way I can answer these kind of challenges and I'm not sure you're being entirely logical. Can we please move on, you think a strong willed character can't be addicted to drugs and I think she can. Sure you've explained why you think that way, and I still disagree. Personally, I have yet to be convinced that a person who is strong willed can use a drug like herioine and act as if they're in control and still will driven, because in reality, that's a dellusional way of thinking. And even if it is possible, I still doubt that it'd apply to your character, because everything about your character cries out as not being strong-willed. But if you want to disagree, without giving me the benefit as to why, that's your decision to make. I would've preferred if you made some valid points, but as far as I can tell there are none that supports your claim. However, it is your character, and if your happy with it, don't change a thing. All I ask is that try to balance your character more in the future because mods aren't required to accept ANY character. They have to make sense to the mod, and if your character doesn't make sense to them they're going encourage you to fix that before they'll accept your character.
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Kotone
Apr 21, 2010 17:55:22 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 21, 2010 17:55:22 GMT -5
Only because you're missunderstanding certain things.
Try and think of all of the hundreds of millions of people in the world who use drugs. Anyone who uses a drug like Heroine, is pretty much addicted. Or cocaine, etc... And NONE of those people could possibly be strong willed? Maybe they have a strong will, but do heroine anyway. Why? Because human beings make choices, and because there are always exceptions to the rules.
Saying a strong willed person couldn't become addicted to drugs, is like saying a smart person couldn't fail a math exam.
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Kotone
Apr 22, 2010 4:11:37 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on Apr 22, 2010 4:11:37 GMT -5
lol I'm not saying it's impossible, just unlikely. I have yet to meet someone with the will to succeed who can use heroine for a year and not let it negatively effect that. However, if someone like that that actually existed, it'd still be different from your character, because your character isn't someone with strong willpower. Your character is someone who's depressed after losing her husband, and instead of relying on her will to keep her moving forward, she relies on drugs because that strong will doesn't exist in her. So, in her case, this isn't about me trying to prove that the strong willed can't become addicted, because as far as I'm concerned that's no longer the issue. The issue here is that your taking someone who obviously isn't strong willed, and your making that their strength. If you can reasonably explain why you consider her a strong willed person, without contradicting what's already been wrtten in her template, I'd be willing to end this one sided game of ping pong and wish you luck in roleplaying out that drug addiction of yours in Gantz. Saying a strong willed person couldn't become addicted to drugs, is like saying a smart person couldn't fail a math exam. umm...I doubt a person with strong willpower would even put themselves in a situation to even become addicted because they would need to disregard self-discipline and and self-control all for the sake of a quick high. And that leads me back to your example, because a smart person "wouldn't" fail a math exam. A smart person would study ahead of time and be prepared. The smart person you're referring to probably didn't have the self-discipline of the smart person I'm referring to. And with that said, you need only wonder who's really smarter out of the two.
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Kotone
Apr 22, 2010 7:26:35 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 22, 2010 7:26:35 GMT -5
Maybe you've been role playing too long and you forget what real life is like.
She has a strong will because I say she does, because that's all I need to do to make it so in the imaginary world of writing. She's a woman because I say she is, she's everything she is and anything she is simply because I've written it. Just becuase she's failed a couple of times in her life doesn't mean she isn't strong willed, it means she's human.
Anyway, I'm done aruguing. And I'm done trying to prove it to you. Maybe I'll edit some of the details and make some improvements that'll make her sound more strong willed to you.
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Kotone
Apr 22, 2010 11:30:20 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on Apr 22, 2010 11:30:20 GMT -5
Maybe you've been role playing too long and you forget what real life is like. Insulting me is unnecessary and it's going to get you nowhere. Have I taken the time to insult you? No. So let's all do ourselves a favor and act our ages. She has a strong will because I say she does, because that's all I need to do to make it so in the imaginary world of writing. She's a woman because I say she is, she's everything she is and anything she is simply because I've written it. This is the wrong attitude to have. If you apply this attitude to roleplaying, not only will people not want to roleplay with you, but they'll also consider you a god-modder. I say this because there may be a time, similar to now when it's obvious there's something off about your character or what you're doing in the roleplay, but you refuse to consider correcting it out of spite and ignorance. Everyone makes mistakes, even I do. Hopefully you understand that you're capable of doing the same with using this strength in your template. Just becuase she's failed a couple of times in her life doesn't mean she isn't strong willed, it means she's human. All humans fail, but a person with that strength wouldn't fail under those circumstances. She would be able to move on without him, but you are hell bent on saying this isn't the case without a good reason as to why. And I'm beginning to think that rather than taking a step back to view your template and my criticism unbiasedly, you're refusing to do so, because you're blinded by some form of pride that prevents your character from being able to be improved. I on the otherhand have been taking a lot of what you said into consideration. When I first spoke to you I was entirely opposed to the idea of a Gantzer having a drug addiction in gantz, because it barely holds value as a weakness in gantz. One would have to feel the need to get high during a mission inorder for it to effect them in a negative way, but even though that may be the case I see nothing wrong with seeing if you can roleplay that out in a way that honors the weakness. For example, if she goes without a fix of the high she's accustomed to she'd go into mental withdraw and you could roleplay that out, because it'd effect her concentration or something in Gantz. Anyway, I'm done aruguing. And I'm done trying to prove it to you. Maybe I'll edit some of the details and make some improvements that'll make her sound more strong willed to you. You proved nothing as far as her strength is concerned, but I'm glad you're considering the idea of elaborating on why she's considered strong willed when everything about her says otherwise. You're on the right track so to speak, and that alone made this "ping pong game" worth it. You gained something out of it, so my criticism was not in vain.
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Kotone
Apr 22, 2010 21:21:47 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 22, 2010 21:21:47 GMT -5
Well, thanks for the feedback on my character. It's just that this discussion has been getting a bit frustrating for me because I feel I have been trying to prove it and you turn around and say I haven't done anything to prove it. I also feel talked down to.
The thing is, I have tried to prove it in my mind, but perhaps it was not in a way that you expected or understood so you think I haven't. I think Ronnie that you are probably very stereotypical. Being addicted to drugs is certainly not characteristic of a strong willed person. But people do so many things that are not characteristic of whatever sterotype they may fit into.
Take the smart person and the math exam illistration. For one thing, many smart people don't even need to study for exams, and lots of people with that ability have failed exams too. I myself had a 97% grade average in Math my final year of high school, and I never studied for a single math exam all year. However, at other times in my life I failed math exams (just once or twice).
If only that were true...
I will do more work on my character and try to implement her strengths and weaknesses throughout.
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Kotone
Apr 22, 2010 23:55:35 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on Apr 22, 2010 23:55:35 GMT -5
Sorry to make you feel that way, but I was just trying to help.
Good luck with whatever you intend to fix.
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Kotone
Apr 26, 2010 10:48:18 GMT -5
Post by scarch on Apr 26, 2010 10:48:18 GMT -5
What do you think about the changes I made to her strengths and weaknesses now Ronnie?
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Kotone
May 2, 2010 17:10:55 GMT -5
Post by ronnie on May 2, 2010 17:10:55 GMT -5
*nods* Mhm, looks okay to me!
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