Goku or Gotenks? Jan 1, 2011 21:13:09 GMT -5
Post by Oka Ace on Jan 1, 2011 21:13:09 GMT -5
Huge sigh. Goku being afraid to fight him is Goku deciding that fusion would be the only solution and not killing Majin Buu when he had a chance. Because he couldn't. And especially can't when Super Buu is much stronger than Majin Buu.
It's obvious. I don't know how much proof you need other than reading the manga over again.
It's the same thing! He said Majin Buu was far too powerful and he didn't think he could win. If he was stronger he would have killed and defeated him even with the amount of time he had. If he can't do that to majin Buu he has no chance against super buu, A buu Gotenks CAN defeat.
And he said "Majin Buu is really strong", not "he's stronger than me"
Yes he did.
Regardless of whether or not he could win, he wouldn't be able to beat him in time before his time ran out. Because the more power he uses, the less time he has. He could have been saying Majin Buu was too strong for him to instantly defeat even if he went all out. Thus dragging out the fight, and thus him leaving Earth before he could win. Once again, there's no definite proof.
Thats the proof right there. If goku could have beaten him he would have. If times an issue than that means he can't be stronger than him. If he's stronger he would have killed Majin buu in 5 minutes because hes stronger. But he didn't so hes weaker. Gotenks can kill Super Buu and was about to until he unfused.
Also, I like how on the next page, Goku states that he didn't even want to try to kill Buu, not because of the energy problem, nor that he might not be able to win, but because he wanted the kids to do it, as he needs the next generation to be strong enough to handle evil forces on their own. In the end, he didn't know whether or not he could defeat Buu in time, but he didn't care to because he wanted them to do it. He was willing to risk it all.
Yes he wanted the kids to do it because he knew how much power the fusion boost would give them. He wasn't worried at all.
He figured he would have lost against Majin Buu. He wasn't too sure I'll give you that. But he was definately not sure he would have won. That means that Majin Buu is either stronger than him or a little bit stronger than him. If he could have defeated him HE WOULD HAVE!
Also, one other thing, Goku later goes on to say to Vegeta that he probably could have beat Fat Buu, but he wanted to leave it up to the Kid's.
See how character statements aren't exactly the most reliable now? I would think Cell yelling out he could destroy the solar system should be sufficient enough, but if Goku later saying that he probably could have beat him isn't enough to convince you that you need actual proof, then I don't know what will. So once again man, not enough proof. = (
lol well played sir. That basically defunks my last post. But it still doesn't say anything to disprove Goku being weaker than Super Buu a Buu Gotenks can defeat.
Thats true when it comes to dealing with the Z warriors but it's not true when it comes to dealing with the kais. The Kais are differant.
Super Buu is the result of Evil Buu eating Fat Buu. And thus, is able to use his power without becoming as innocent. These are manga facts. That is exactly what we saw. There's no manga panel that says Super Buu rely's on a certain Kai's power more. It's simply that he doesn't have his conscious hindered and is thus more to his true potential. And even if he is using a kai's power more (no proof that he is) the strongest Kai is an ant compared to Kid Buu. So it doesn't make him that much stronger anyway. Therefore, Super Buu is not that much stronger than Fat Buu regardless.
Ok here is a DBZ lesson. Kid Buu first absorbed South Kaio After a hard fought battle. Becoming what the fans had called Buff Buu. Buff Buu looks exactly like Super Buu. And after this absorbtion it was noted by east kai that Buu's power increased. Drastically as South kaio was the strongest Kai of all.
Buff Buu then killed the North and the west Kaios. Before he could kill the east Kaio, the leader of the kais "Da Kaio" who was possesed of nothing but pure good and innocence allowed himself to be absorbed by Buu.
This absorption transformed Buff Buu into the Majin Buu the first Buu we saw that hatched from the egg. And because of the goodness in Da Kaio he influences Majin Buu more than his evil nature does and the power gained from South Kaio.
He even looks like Da Kaio. Fat and the skwinty eyes.
After Hurcule turned Majin Buu good, his evil side came out after the puppy got shot. This split him into two differant Buu's what fans have dubbed Evil Buu and Mr. Buu. Evil Buu wins the fight and absorbs Mr. Buu. Because the evil side won, Da Kaios power basically is the essence of Mr. Buu is supressed. And the Evil malevolence Buu had and power of the South Kaio comes back. Making Super Buu the strongest Buu yet.
THIS is UNdisputable and if you argue with it, I'll kill you.
They're equal now? Other than the fact that Goku said that he could kill Buu if he charged up his power? Also other than the fact that Buu has regeneration powers? If it weren't for those, he would have been dead 10 times over. Goku was obviously superior in power-level. But Kid Buu outlasted him via regeneration/stamina. Goku spent time using attacks that weren't enough to permanently do the job, then when he finally realized he needed something bigger, he needed to charge up his energy for a minute.
Sorry I forgot Goku said that >_>. Yeah he could have finished Kid Buu at the peak of his power, and maybe Majin Buu too. But not Super Buu which is what were arguing about. Anything Majin Buu and Kid Buu related should be a moot point by now since both of them are weaker than Super Buu.
Now I ask YOU show me proof that Goku is stronger than Super Buu. Gotenks clearly is. Had of killed Super Buu had he not unfused.
You show me proof that they can't. Which they all did wipe the floor with super Buu. You show me proof that Goku is capable of the same. Other than Filler.
It's the power of fusion, and SSJ3.
SSJ3 Goku has never fought super Buu in the manga. If you're referring to that it's filler. Also the reason thier fusion was so drastically powerful was the old Kai stated Potara was the strongest fusion. Plus Goku and Vegeta being rivals added to the boost. And it doesn't take their equal power it takes all the strength they have into the equation. Still none of this has to do with our discussion on whether SSJ3 Goku could take on Super Buu.
SSJ3 is a strong transformation. But I don't see how Gotenks is stronger than Goku when the only reason Gotenks attained SSJ3 was because of the two of them being SSJ's and fusing together. There's no evidence to provide otherwise. Seriously man. It's not like they were two SSJ 2's. They were regular SSJ's. They only just barely attained SSJ3. There's nothing saying that they were special a SSJ3. And therefore, they should be in Goku's power realm regardless. If they're stronger, it's not by much.
You underestimate the power of fusion and thats your problem. Goku said the weakest people used the technique and became some of the strongest warriors in the galaxy. It's a big galaxy and thats a bold statement from Goku.
Also if he knew how strong Buu was he wouldn't have bet the worlds fate on a gambit of a fighter weaker than himself. As he loves the earth. And he believed in the fusion enough to put it in danger.
You overestimate one Saiyan compared too 2 saiyans combined just because they're kids doesn't mean together with fusion they can't surpass him.
And heres the scan www.mangareader.net/105-3156-7/dragon-ball/chapter-507.html
Answer me this fayrra. Why would Goku be so worried about the rings being destroyed if he was capable of destroying Super Buu? The reason they went in there was to remove, Piccolo, Trunks Goten and Gohan from Super Buu. Thinking he would turn back into the first Super Buu that Gotenks nearly killed.
Why was he upset if he had the power of defeating him without fusion?
He was pissed because he knows he and Vegita are no match for Super Buu.